Just look at all the shiny mac-induced fun that happens when a highly branded product company *cough*Apple*cough* wants to develop it’s products, with it’s own product…. or so some would think.
Well, for some of you, it’s time to put that Apple sticker back on your rear windshield. Siemens PLM software has announced the commercial availability for ‘native-support’ of NX6 on the Mac. This makes Siemens PLM the first CAD/PLM company, with Windows PC, Linux and full-on Mac version of their software. Did we ever think it wouldn’t happen?
The NX6 for Mac release has all the 3D modeling features of the Windows and Linux versions, including that good ol’ Synchronous Technology for all your history-based/history-free modeling enjoyment. Here’s some quick facts on the release, one that may surprise you and some video to prove it’s actually real.
- It is a 64-bit Mac OS X application
- It runs on Mac OS X 10.5.5 or later
- It requires an Intel-based Mac
- It uses Motif Linux GUI emulation
- No current plans for a Mac-style GUI
Behind the scenes
John Baker, product evangelist for Siemens PLM admitted the reason for emulation via an Eng-Tips forum post.
Until it can be demonstrated that there is sufficient market opportunity which would justify the expense involved in anything other than a ‘Linux’ type of GUI for the Mac, this will have to do. It’s not so much a technical issue as it is a business decision….since Windows-based NX makes up better than 90% of our worldwide installed base”
Kinda makes sense, as this is why the other 3D MCAD companies haven’t gone this direction. Still, 10% is a significant amount, especially if the 10% are the dedicated Mac user kind. It’s always worth it for the users. The companies need to either take the plunge, support usage via bootcamp, or risk losing a small, but mighty, base of loyal Mac users.
Update! Take a look at Al Dean’s interview with the Paul Brown from Siemens in Siemens NX6 on OS X is a-go-go to find out more on the functionality and development.
Via Siemens PLM
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Face it, nobody is gonna actually change CAD platforms just because of lack of Mac support. If they are already using a particular CAD program, they have more invested in that than they do in one particular OS. You might see an occasional nut-job make a highly dramatized switch, but people are generally smarter than that.
Plus, you've gotta split that 10% between Mac and Linux. That seriously diminishes the argument for either one.
Unigraphics has a long history of Unix use, so this is kind of a “best case” for a mac version. I'm a big believer in alternatives, but I still don't believe that the alternatives in the case of CAD make much sense, doubly so for historically windows-based CAD. People leave their brains at home when they start talking about mac and linux.
Hmm, all this clamoring for getting on Mac, and Apple continues to punish the professionals that depend on their products to get work done. The latest shenanigans with castrating the MacBookPro are the tip of the iceberg. I've always mulled over the idea of switching, but the more I read, the more I think I'm better off staying on the “dark side”
Apple destroys MacBook Pro
http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=31388
I've been a user of Unix, Windows and Mac OS for some time now. Any arguement dismissing the Mac OS as a viable solution can ONLY come from a user with no skin in the game, i.e. you propbably don't personally spend a dime for the tools you use (OPM= Other Peoples Money). Back when the monolithic Cad packages (Catia, UG, SDRC-Ideas) ONLY existed on UNIX workstation, i.e. HP, SGI and the like I had the foresight to push UG on Windows NT workstations saving to the bottomline $50,000.00 plus per workstation. I just recently pawned off $10,000.00 worth of Windows equipment for Mac OS X and haven't look back since. Oh yeah, did I mention I have skin in the game. In other words I make my own purchases with my own money and not some departments design budget. What that means is I do my research and to stay competitive I have to get the best bang for the buck, unlike most who respond or make comments using this communications format.
REAL TALK.
The MAC OS is nothing more than a UNIX kernel with Apples very intuitive GUI. Anyone with any experience in sourcing monolithic, missions critical applications KNOWS Windows can't hold a UNIX OS's jock strap when it comes to a stable environment and speed. For anyone that doesn't already get… this equals USD. That said MAC OS is… how shall I say it, far superior than any Windows OS currently available. Not to mention MAC OS even runs Windows OS and apps better, faster and more stable than Windows. And in case you were unaware on the Intel platform.
Time doesn't allow for me to discuss much further. Just next time, do everyone who reads this the kindness of doing a better job researching your position.
I get it… And yes unfortunate for Apple especially.
“… do everyone who reads this the kindness of doing a better job researching your position.”
You need to take some of your own advice. I'm an independent contractor, and every tool I buy is with my own money. You are fully off the mark.
You can't claim that Mac, unix and Linux and all the flavors of Linux are direct equivalents, because it takes some effort to make and maintain the software for each.
Some of the reasons I'm hesitant to switch from Windows to Mac:
- current investment in Win OS (not just CAD but related business apps)
- personal lack of problems dealing with Win XP (irregardless of whether Mac OS/Linux are more stable – no argument from me – the issue hasn't been stability; I very, very rarely crash, thus such discussions are pragmatically meaningless to me at this time)
- the surprising number of problems I hear from Mac owners (some of whom will still defend their machine with fanatical zeal even though they're forced to shell out additional money or make a trip to the “bar” for help).
- I enjoy building my own machines and find the limited options available from Apple unappealing.
By the way, like Matt, I use my own money to purchase the tools I use. In fact, if NX were in my price range, I might actually give the Mac more consideration. As I currently run Wildfire and would have to run a Mac in emulation, I don't see sufficient ROI to warrant a switch at this time.
As a reluctant PC user by day and Mac user by night, I'm thrilled that a major CAD system is now offered for the OSX platform. It irritates me to no end that I'm confined to the Windows platform as a SolidWorks user and that I'll be denied service from the VAR if I'm running Windows on Mac hardware.
When I was offered my current position, I had the option of selecting the most appropriate CAD platform to get the job done, even with years of legacy SolidWorks data. If I was making that choice now, it's highly possible I would go with Siemens PLM and Apple hardware, especially considering recent innovation from Siemens.
AS Josh eluded to, Apple has been developing it's products on NX for some time. I'm sure there are is some advantages for Apple to be able to develop its products on its own hardware but all in all this is really just a political move for Siemens.
Will it pay off? Will people switch to NX just because it's available on the MAC?
Are the other CAD vendors really afraid of this move?
In my opinion, the added headache/development time isn't worth small amount of POTENTIAL market share..
Besides, if MAC users really want to do CAD, there is always Vellum…
yep, there is a certain amount of giddiness that occurs when the Mac word is mentioned. It's been ages since I've used Mac. I'm fascinated at not only the discussion around the Apple products, but also the user loyalty and what companies are doing to possess/copy it.
Anyway, the only reason I'd even consider a switch in platform would be during an upgrade. I'm looking at Win7 coming up, a hardware upgrade and high def becoming more prevalent. If a Mac version was available for most of the programs I used, I'd consider the switch, but here's the big point, I'd be super frustrated if I had to reboot to use another program.
yep, and the investment aspect multiplies with a business that has to look at software/hardware/upgrades/server support/IT support/budget. It's a nightmare as it is with one OS from all my experiences. I've got to stay in a budget which doesn't nearly come close to what it would take to move to another platform. However, it would be interesting to look at integrating a user and stack up the results against the existing framework. That's the only way I see it happening in the environment I'm involved with.
The absolute best thing SolidWorks or a SolidWorks VAR could do right now, is offer support for bootcamp/parallels. If there are only 10% mac users out there, this would hardly be any support effort at all. Oh, but what if more people find out about the support and start moving to OSX and it goes to 15% or 25%? hmmm.
I'm wondering what people think about the Motif emulation they did with NX6. Does it really qualify as a native app? It's an interesting marketing move for sure. They are going after a certain segment. I think it would have been better served porting SolidEdge (cheaper for user, more maketshare, etc)… but Apple doesn't use SolidEdge do they
You state that OSX is more stable than Windows. You also cite this in reference to CAD software. Please state some proof.
Sure, Solidworks, and all other CAD software, crashes frequently. I haven't seen Windows crash in years. WinXP/Vista is not Windows 95.
My wife's old Mac used to crash at least once a week, running OSX 10.2. So by my personal experience my Windows (both at home and at work) was significantly more stable than her OSX.
Then again, if you can prove that Windows is less stable than OSX, go ahead.
I'm super stoked to have UGNX running natively on Mac OS. I'm in the minority; NX is the only app I use that wasn't Mac OS native. Even though I have a Bootcamp partition with NX installed, actually getting an assembly loaded while I'm in a factory in China has always been an involved process. You guys can argue the politics and marketing/business strategies. I'm going to enjoy not having to reboot to get at my CAD files regardless.
I liked it. To be honest, they could spend a gazillion dollars redeveloping everything for cocoa/ruby whatever its called these days, but you'd get so little benefit from it would be proper waste of time. it works. its works well (with the exception of a few bits and bobs). and like Joe says below. It saves rebooting your mac. I think there's a huge amount of nonsense talked about this stuff, by peeps that have very little experience or need to comment on it. some peeps just like picking a fight I think.
If you use the hardware/software from Apple. good. if you don't. Shut it up. Simple man.
In general I like Cocoa-based interfaces better than X11/UNIX/Motif. That said, I think there is plenty of opportunity for Siemens to improve the NX interface without getting Cocoa in the mix. Though, to be fair, the NX6 interface is better than NX4 (haven't used NX5).
“Does it qualify as a native app?”
I didn't have to reboot into windows to open my UG file. Native enough for me. That perspective may change with more time behind the wheel.
Couple of things:
1. Independent contractor doesn't mean you buy your own equipment as I am an independent contractor and own my own company. So, yes I have to pay for my workstations, monitors, printer and apps. I tend to shop around.
2. I didn't even come close to saying Unix, Linux and MAC OS are even close. What I did was make a comparison between UNIX vs. Windows. There is however no viable arguement today UNIX vs. Windows, therefore my example stands as MAC OS is a UNIX variant. Remember Nextstep? No, didn't think so.
Don't get me wrong, I used to own $10,000 of Windows equipment. My solution was to hold it until it depreciated then purchase a MAC. I'm thrilled that NX is coming over to the Darkside. More to come I suspect, again since MAC OS runs Windows better on a MAC. You know the saying, once you go MAC you won't go back…. Just smile.
Vellum is OK. Has any one checked Alibre?
Dude… If you don't know by now you probably just don't want to know.
Haha. Your response merely proves my point that you are all emotion and absolutely no fact.
As I mentioned, I have practical, real reasons for running both Windows and OSX. Neither of them are driven because one is “more stable” than the other; because it isn't true, as you are obviously unable to admit to yourself.
Al,
People who don't use Mac have a great deal at stake in this argument. We have fought to get the software to where it is in terms of functionality and stability, and to throw it all away just for a small minority of users (and non-users) whose heads have been turned by marketing gimmicks would be unfortunate. Throwing all of the necessary development $$ into a Mac version would be a colossal waste of money.
How many more customers will someone like SolidWorks gain by adding a Mac version? Very few. If people really need something like SW, they are using something like SW on Windows because nothing is available on Mac.
How many customers will SW lose because they don't change to Mac? None until maybe another SW-esque product makes the jump. And by that, I don't mean NX, Rhino, VectorWorks, AutoCAD, Bricscad, Alias, et al, I mean Inventor or Solid Edge.
If you don't buy your own CAD software that you use for a living, shut it up.
The Apple sticker never came off my rear window!
Good to hear, hope more companies follow
Well this is interesting. I pay for all my own software and hardware. I've currently got active licenses of SolidWorks Professional, VX Designer, Ashlar-Vellum Cobalt and Graphite, FormZ and many others. When I started my business in 1990 I stupidly bought the best machine I could find and the best software I could afford……so it was an Apple Mac IIfx (8MB RAM, 80MB hard drive) – £6k – monitor and graphics card was extra! Software was Microstation Mac, Modelshop and swivel3d. I ditched Microstation after 2 years and switched to MiniCad (now VectorWorks), and then FormZ a year later replaced Modelshop and Swivel3D.
As the years went on my machines changed but I stayed on macs as I had a very large investment in Mac software – much of which only ran on a Mac at the time (Quark Xpress, Photoshop, Freehand, FormZ, Vellum 3D, Minicad etc).
In 1999 I bought my first PC to run SolidWorks. So at that time I was running a SGI Visual NT workstation (which I picked up ex lease for £600 – a bargain!) to run a customer's copy of SolidWorks. Then a funny thing happened.
All the software that I was running as Mac only suddenly started to appear on Windows as well. What was more (and to this day only original Mac software does this) these same companies let users run the software on either Mac or Windows – at no extra cost! So by 2001 I was running FormZ, VectorWorks, Ashlar-Vellum Cobalt and Graphite on the PC. With no issues. faster than on the Mac.
I've asked many of these developers why they started offering Windows versions in the late 90s and they all say – because that is where the CAD market was and at the time Apple was in dire straits and in decline and Windows machines were a lot cheaper. It was only when Steve Jobs returned to Apple and OSX was released that Apple's rise started again – but by this time the CAD market had switched almost entirely to Windows.
So here's the thing now. I run 2 Macs (a G5 and an Intel iMac – I've also got an old Powerbook but its never used now), 3 PCs (a newish workstation and a workstation laptop that is on its last legs, and an old Dell workstation used as a print server).
Pretty much all the CAD is done on Windows machines. All the graphics and internet stuff is done on macs. I have CAD applications that run natively on Macs but I still choose to run them on Windows. Why? Well because they run better on windows. Why? I have no idea, but they just do. Take Ashlar-Vellum software as an example. It has always been Mac, but it runs far better on Windows – the graphics performance is significantly better. You could argue this is down to the programming – perhaps – but I see the same with FormZ and VectorWorks (in 3D).
Contrast this to graphics applications like Adobe CS4 and Quark Xpress. Here, the Mac is better. Everything is more fluid, better linked, more stable. I did dabble with CS1 on Windows for a while but compared to the Mac version it was crap.
When Apple announced Intel hardware I thought I would switch the hardware to Apple but having considered all this long and hard I just could not justify the cost vs the benefits. When I upgraded my main CAD machine last year I was faced with a choice of a Mac Pro at £2500 with 3 year Apple care warranty plus a new screen cost on top, or an HP xw4600 (XP/4GB RAM, Quad core) with more hard drive space, a decent certified Quadro card (FX1700), and an HP widescreen display….and a 5 year on site next day warranty…..all for £1300. As they say it was a no brainer. As much as I like Macs they are just too expensive at the entry level (which I always buy at).
When I replace my laptop soon will I opt for a new Apple MacBook Pro or a Dell? Now that is one I'm not sure about. On a laptop I can see the benefits of having it all. I can run all the graphics apps and the CAD apps under Bootcamp…..but…..I cannot get a certified system to run all the gizmos in SolidWorks.
So OK this is along post but it is not always a case of Macs are best, or Windows is better. There are benefits to both platforms. Would I switch to a new CAD system if it ran natively on macs? No. Platform is not the decider I use – it is the quality of the software. If SolidWorks ran natively would I switch? Possibly. Because this assumes that if it did run natively they would enable things like RealView etc to run on Mac hardware and typical graphics cards. Not only that I would have to be convinced that the performance is as good or better on mac – as knowing what I know about native Mac software I don't think this is always necessarily the case.
Thanks Kevin, it's great to hear actual experience with both platforms and you've been through it all it seems. Compared to what you paid starting out in 1990, the Mac today is a DEAL! amazing the price difference. Thanks for filling us in on your experience.
Not true Matt (Lombard). I used AutoCad & Orcad for years on the PC platform. Over time I came to despise the Microsoft OS to a point that I have now converted over to using Vector Works to avoid the PC. Bootcamp I have never considered a viable solution. Besides, the last thing I want on my MAC is Microsoft Windows (in any version).
Not true Matt (Lombard). I used AutoCad & Orcad for years on the PC platform. Over time I came to despise the Microsoft OS to a point that I have now converted over to using Vector Works to avoid the PC. Bootcamp I have never considered a viable solution. Besides, the last thing I want on my MAC is Microsoft Windows (in any version).
hallo can you help me to get it work i got some problems installing UGS NX 6 on my imac
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